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ghhedman
RO# 8415
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 Posted - Jun 08 2012 : 19:02:57
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I have a 5 liter MPI with remote oil filter... mounted upside down. I thought I would do the oil and filter change myself this time but I can not budge the filter loose and at this point it is partially collapsed from my futal efforts, any suggestions??
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Homeport:
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jmeirhofer
RO# 30972
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Posted - Jun 08 2012 : 19:18:01
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Large screwdriver through the cross section
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John
1997 Trojan 440 Express
"Son, I've got a very low bull$*%t tolerance" -- Pancho Carter
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Homeport: Baltimore, MD
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zane
RO# 19940
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Posted - Jun 08 2012 : 21:36:15
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Get the motor hot and try it again. If that fails then go to the screwdriver. That's pretty much my 2 step .
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Homeport: long island, n.y.
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zane
RO# 19940
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Posted - Jun 08 2012 : 22:02:12
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I skipped over the part where you collapsed the filter!! Go straight to the screwdriver!
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Homeport: long island, n.y.
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sugilbert
RO# 3854
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Posted - Jun 08 2012 : 22:03:28
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If not punctured, warm engine. If already punctured, use an electric heat gun or hair dryer on base.
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Steve
"L'Chiam" 29' 2000 Regal Commodore 2660 (2765) T/4.3 Alphas |
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Homeport: Michigan City/South Bend, IN
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ghhedman
RO# 8415
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Posted - Jun 08 2012 : 22:39:14
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Well, we got it as hot as we couold with a hair dryer....maybe not such a good idea but finally had to go to a hot filter with the screwdriver trick, step 2. Never will I let someone else do that. The next challenge is the fuel/water filter, much harder to get to so I hope it isn't so tight. Bright spot, the oil has been draining for about a month so there was almost no clean up needed when it finally let loose.
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Homeport:
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rawidman
RO# 25110
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Posted - Jun 09 2012 : 06:28:55
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When removing a filter, the closer to the base of the filter that you place the wrench, the less likely you are to crush it.
That said, if it's installed properly, it should come off rather easily. The instructions are often printed on the filter.
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Ron
2000 Camano Troll |
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Homeport: Charleston, SC
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troublemaker
RO# 32512
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Posted - Jun 09 2012 : 07:48:34
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smear a little oil around the seal on the new filters, hand tighten the filters, you should have no problems the next time toy service the engine.
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| TM |
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Homeport: British Columbia
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Sandy
RO# 1159
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Posted - Jun 09 2012 : 14:51:12
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...And just a little Teflon grease works even better for oil & fuel filter gaskets ( & on fuel filters gives added benefit of better seal protection against suction air leak according to Floscan.) .
If you have the problem again, position the wrench as Ron suggests and keep in mind constant pressure can work better than gut-busting brute force as the gasket gradually deforms and gives way. Sometimes one can wedge the handle of the wrench to keep constant pressure on a fuel or oil filter and it will eventually give way while you are off working on other chores. Personally , I prefer the smooth band wrenches to the potentially cutting toothed-band type, though a buffer strip of sandpaper or rubber for added friction may be necessary.
Also, as TM notes- very wise to heed the instruction with or on the oil filter to limit tightening to usually about + 3/4 turn after making contact with the bracket. Easily done by hand. Always tough to guess what someone else who last changed the oil filter may have done.
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| Sandy |
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Homeport: The Vineyard
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jtybt15
RO# 3300
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Posted - Jun 09 2012 : 17:58:09
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I hope you have the remote filter mounting bracket positioned so the filter is hanging down so you don't drain the oil into the bilge when you remove the filter.
I cannot believe, for the life of me, that anyone with the slightest common sense would mount the oil filter so you make a mess...and I'm talking directly at all the stoopid manufacturers.
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Charlie
There is much to be said, in a world like ours, for taking the world as you find it and fishing with a worm.-Bliss Perry, 1904
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Homeport: Ca
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Tim Bromund
RO# 18797
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Posted - Jun 09 2012 : 18:54:18
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The filter is by far the worst part of oil changes on my boat, it is at the back of the block in the most godawful inaccessible spot imaginable. I do believe if I have have to have the motor lifted for something, a remote filter set up is an absolute must install.
Tim
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1986 Thompson 8652 Offshore Hardtop "FishStyx"
Salad is what FOOD Eats
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Homeport: Olcott Beach, NY
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Rick D
RO# 32381
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Posted - Jun 09 2012 : 21:01:27
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I planned on a remote filter this off season at least on my port engine as it was a nightmare to get off.... but didn't get to it. One comment/question about tightening it... I've worked on plenty of cars and know the procedure, so when I was bit*ching about how difficult it was to get the filter off to the yard I used to have my boat at, they said "We tighten the filters we do engine service on so they have no risk of coming loose and spilling oil into the bilge". I heard that and asked a few others who work on a boats and most said it was nonsense and unnecessary, but one other fellow said he does the same.
Well, when I pull my new filters on, they are hand tight + 1/4 turn... no more. I think the biggest chance of leak from a filter is if you leave the old rubber ring on.. then your going to have issues... but not sure if there is a group of boaters out there tightening their filters with wrenches causing absolute nightmares for the do it yourself boat owner like my self.
--Rick
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Homeport: Guilford, CT
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BillK
RO# 775
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Posted - Jun 10 2012 : 15:10:59
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I only hand tighten my oil and fuel filters and apply a coating of oil to the rubber ring - never put a wrench on a filter to install it!. They are still a PIA to get loose. I have tried a number of oil filter wrenches, the best one so far for me is the old fashion one that looks like a big pair of pliers. Never fails to get a filter loose. A trick on the upside down remote mounted filters - poke a hole in the top of the filter before you remove it - that will let the oil drain out before you remove it.
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Homeport: Lake Tillery, NC
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Hydro Guy
RO# 20481
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Posted - Jun 10 2012 : 15:18:21
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I had a similar problem with a oil filter sold by a nationally know boat engine manufacturer. The shell of the filter was so thin that it collapsed almost immediately when I tried to remove it. Next it tore and leaked oil. Eventually I removed the oil inlet and outlet fittings on the remote oil filter housing, unbolted it, and took the entire mess into the workshop. I removed all of the metal shell on the filter and accessed the series of holes surrounding the screw threads that are visible on the top of the filter. I used a hammer and a punch to try to unscrew the filter threads from the remote filter mount. No luck there, the holes in the steel filter top also tore. Next I used a Dremil tool to cut around inside the filter and decouple the filter threads from the gasket on the oil filter. I cut the steel web between every set of holes on the top of the filter. That did the trick and the entire mess was finally unscrewed. Opinion 1) the filter shell was cheap and too thin, opinion 2) the gasket was cheap and had somehow bonded to the seat on the remote filter housing. And yes I always lubricate the filter gasket with new oil upon filter installation.
Lessons learned: never ever buy another filter from that company and stick with Volvo parts.
I have the screw portion of the filter nailed up in the shop as an example of how crazy it can get to just do a simple job.
You may also be able to remove the remote filter housing next and do the job on your workbench before you penetrate the filter shell and leak oil in the bilge. Before you install the new filter, mark in permanent ink an arrow to show the direction to turn the filter OFF. Hanging upside down in an engine compartment while trying to turn a filter may have gotten you confused as to the correct direction of rotation.
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Phil
Four Winns Sundowner 255, "Simply Irresistible" She's so fine, there is no tell'n where the money went. |
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Homeport: Nevada
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ghhedman
RO# 8415
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Posted - Jun 10 2012 : 19:43:30
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I too will never understand some of the thought process that goes in to how manufactures decide on how an oil filter should be mounted, upside down does not seem like a good choice. I always lube the new filter gasket with new oil and always hand tighten but I guess I can understand a marinas tolerance to risk...$$ so tighten that sucker down!!! On the plus side, draining the oil is a breeze, take the water drain plug out, it is connected to a 3 foot hose by a small cable with swivels that is attached to the crankcase. I loosen the oil fill cap (don't really know it that helps) and end up with no mess.
Started and ran great over the weekend so I think with a few more tweeks we will be ready for a full week of fun on the water starting next Sunday. Our annual family gathering includes about 35 folks from all over the country and I believe this is the 22nd year.
Thanks to all for the tips and advice, great stuff!
Rustyone67
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Dave H
RO# 7245
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Posted - Jun 13 2012 : 12:12:56
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A note on draining a filter. I have partially drained mine to make handling them easier once removed. I put a hole in to drain them partially then screw in a sheet metal screw to plug my drain hole. They are then easy to handle when they are off.
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Homeport: Mystic, CT
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ronp
RO# 23477
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Posted - Jun 13 2012 : 12:26:01
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Dave, good suggestion. I don't know why I never thought of that. My Mercruiser filter is mounted sideways and always makes a mess.
And on the subject of filter crushing, that happened to me last fall and I had to remove the power steering pump to get a wrench on the base of the filter and have any room to swing it. Not a user friendly layout for a little engine in a big space. To top it off, that was when I decided to change the belts, and found that one belt cannot be removed without removing the front engine mount. rb2rb2@gr5tgr5t#$%^&*! idiots.
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Thanks,
Ron |
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Homeport: Amityville, NY
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j-d
RO# 15782
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Posted - Jun 13 2012 : 12:36:51
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Ron,
The old straight-six MerCs were that way, front mount had to be separated to change the belt. The old hands at it would install two belts. One on the pulleys, the other taped or ziptied out of the way. Then if the belt failed on the water, they only had to cut the old away and put the spare one in service.
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God Bless, jd
1996 Sea Ray 215EC
Alpha One GEN II 5.7L/350CID/EFI/220HP
14-1/2*19 Stainless RWC
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Homeport: Sunny Florida
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gcolton
RO# 9708
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Posted - Jun 13 2012 : 13:04:33
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When I first bought my boat I could not remove either filter. I wound up just removing the filter mounting bracket. One hose connection and two bolts and we were off to my garage to remove those filters in comfort.
George
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| If you are not boating or golfing you are wasting your day. |
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Homeport: EAFB Yacht Club
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rawidman
RO# 25110
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Posted - Jun 13 2012 : 16:50:25
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quote:
Originally posted by Rick D
.......I've worked on plenty of cars and know the procedure, so when I was bit*ching about how difficult it was to get the filter off to the yard I used to have my boat at, they said "We tighten the filters we do engine service on so they have no risk of coming loose and spilling oil into the bilge". .........
That's a good example of why you need to take the advice of "mechanics" with a grain or two of salt sometimes.
The engine manufacturer specifies how to install the filter, the filter manufacturer specifies how to install the filter. These folks designed and built the equipment, they should know.
Now, along comes some self trained "mechanic" who thinks he has a better way.
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Ron
2000 Camano Troll |
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Homeport: Charleston, SC
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ghhedman
RO# 8415
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Posted - Jun 13 2012 : 17:34:01
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When doing battle with my oil filter I was leaning over the side of the boat and at some point must have had my weight on my rib cage only. Must have cracked a rib or two. Really painful if you have to sneeze or cough!! Today I bought kind of a girdle thing to see it it will stabalize things a little. So, I guess I won that battle but I'm not sure about the war yet.
Rustyone67
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BillK
RO# 775
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Posted - Jun 13 2012 : 17:41:39
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How often does an oil filter work itself loose? I've had my share of boats / cars over 25yrs - I've never had a filter come loose. I suspect most of you have the same experience. In fact I have had more problems and messes to clean up from trying to get an overtighted filter off. Handtighten 1/4 turn past where the filter seats - and you wil never have a problem.
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Homeport: Lake Tillery, NC
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ghhedman
RO# 8415
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Posted - Jun 14 2012 : 21:45:12
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Happened to me only once in all these years BillK. It was a 69 Mustang coupe that I married/adopted, don't know who put that filter on but it made a large mess of engine compartment, luckily found the problem before frying the engine!
Rustyone67
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Homeport:
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November Charlie
RO# 824
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Posted - Jun 14 2012 : 23:53:59
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If you put any effort into tightening the filter - it's too tight.
Best filter wrench I've ever used is - as strange as this really is - one that I got at Ocean State Job Lot. It's one of those five finger ratchet jobs that tightens as it turns. Bought that thing (for probably a $1.99, but hell if I remember) knowing it was a throwaway, like any tools you buy at a discount 'store', but that thing has been serving me faithfully for a decade and a half now, and beats the hell out of any strap wrench I've ever used.
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| My signature line is cooler than your signature line. |
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Homeport: Northeast
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Salvatore356
RO# 32937
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Posted - Jun 15 2012 : 05:26:47
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Thats why you just hand tight filters Do not use a tool. Remember clockwise tight counter clockwise loose. When your upside down you forget wich way to turn.
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Homeport: NJ
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BillK
RO# 775
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Posted - Jun 15 2012 : 07:48:28
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Righty tighty - lefty loosey!
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Homeport: Lake Tillery, NC
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Oil filter
