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Silver Lining
RO# 29390
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Posted - Jul 30 2012 : 16:02:13
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I am wondering how or if those of you who travel well offshore file float plans. I find it very difficult when we are moving the boat long distances offshore from Maryland to the Bahamas and even more difficult when island hopping as we can go days without power, phones or electricity. We don’t always know where or what island we will next arrive, we may anchor out for a few days, or have a mechanical problem that slows us way down making a timely passage impossible.
We carry a proper set of safety gear including an offshore 6 person Viking liferaft (weighs 100 lbs), a hydrostatic release epirb, a hand held epirb, comprehensive ditch bags (including handheld VHF and gps) several Type I lifejackets strategically positioned, offshore inflatable lifejackets with harness and tethers, an abundance of flares, etc. We also have a 30 hp RIB easy to float off the swim platform.
Due to the difficulties in closing out or initiating float plans from remote areas, we have relied many times on carrying extensive safety gear and 2 epirbs. We let someone know what our approximate voyage plans and timing are, but don’t file specific transit details and times due to all of the uncertainties and huge problems caused if one does not properly close out a float plan. How do sailors going for month long voyages with extended anchoring deal with this?
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-Rick
Viking Sport Cruiser 50FY
"Silver Lining" |
Edited by - Silver Lining on Jul 30 2012 18:53:07
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Homeport: Chesapeake, MD
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Billylll
RO# 24494
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Posted - Jul 30 2012 : 19:21:59
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As much as I don't like them a "SPOT" on GlobalStar would be a great device for you or the IMNARSAT data only device Mini C or E-Trac. A new promissing device is the DeLorme InReach or the Iridium Extreme using the IRIDIUM satellite network and a I-Pad or I-Phone or a small terminal provides position data and sending & recieving text messages. The Xxtreme also allows voice messages from anywhere on the planet. These devices (pick one) would allow you to send emergency messages and for people to track you if you wanted via the Internet.
Bill
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WirelessOne,
40 Mainship
Sedan Bridge
Little Egg, N.J. |
Edited by - Billylll on Jul 30 2012 21:04:04 |
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Homeport: Tuckerton, N.J.
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Radioactive
RO# 3238
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Posted - Jul 30 2012 : 19:25:47
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Don't actually have a solution, but part of the problem is that what you describe has no fixed destination, and no fixed ETA ( thus, no overdue time/date )
I'm not swure how to resolve the issue...
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Bill
"No matter where you go, there you are." -- Buckaroo Bonzai
"There is nothing, absolutely nothing, half so much worth doing as simply messing about in boats." - Kenneth Grahame |
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Homeport: MS Gulf Coast
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Billylll
RO# 24494
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 Posted - Jul 30 2012 : 19:29:34
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quote:
Originally posted by Radioactive
Don't actually have a solution, but part of the problem is that what you describe has no fixed destination, and no fixed ETA ( thus, no overdue time/date )
I'm not swure how to resolve the issue...
It can be resolved by having the proper communications gear where those that care about you can track you via the Internet or you can send 2 way text messages in an emergency to the proper authorities. The Fleet Broadband FB150 is great (dial 505#) but really too expensive in my opinion. I have one so I know.
Bill
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WirelessOne,
40 Mainship
Sedan Bridge
Little Egg, N.J. |
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Homeport: Tuckerton, N.J.
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boatbum
RO# 36
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Posted - Jul 30 2012 : 20:01:28
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Rick I think you are overstating the problem.
First, from Maryland down to a jump point to the Bahamas;
If you are not connected somehow in the U.S., and cannot outline your plans for the next day or two over a phone or the internet, file for some government assistance because it seems like people that are on welfare are better connected than you  I know we could always connect with a Verizon air card, our cell phones, or free wifi at a marina when we needed to. A couple of close relatives always know where and when we are going when we are on the move.
This is also true in the Bahamas. Everyone we have entrusted knows our next move the day before we move and this includes an approximate arrival time based on conditions and estimates using our experience and nav software. We have always been able to communicate via the internet or a cell phone regardless of where we are in the Bahamas or the U.S..
As far as the "out back" itinerary, folks we know carry a sat phone. Spot is another means to xmit a help or safe arrival message which by the way, we are very aggressive about sending one way or another. No need in letting people worry needlessly.
If you are worried about getting help when you are "out back" it doesn't matter what you have. Expect that help is going to be arriving later than you need it.
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| It's easy to be a liberal when you have tons of cash, or, you really need it. |
Edited by - boatbum on Jul 30 2012 20:07:23 |
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Billylll
RO# 24494
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Posted - Jul 30 2012 : 20:37:37
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Boatbum that was a good post however there are rather large areas in coastal NC through northern Florida where cell SVC is almost non existent. I keep hearing WiFi stinks in the Bahamas and the southern US Coast it's probably due to poor backhaul. I think the SPOT might solve the "what if" dilemma because it is portable and can be taken to your liferaft. Having a 406 GPS EPIRB is nice but really one way communications that you don't know if it was missed or not working. As far as the Calvary coming I think you are SPOT on but at least with the SPOT you would know your message was recieved. Since I have never done any long distance cruising I can only imagine what would at a minimum make me feel safe if we did have a problem "out back".
Bill
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WirelessOne,
40 Mainship
Sedan Bridge
Little Egg, N.J. |
Edited by - Billylll on Jul 30 2012 20:39:14 |
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Homeport: Tuckerton, N.J.
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mixman
RO# 25362
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Posted - Jul 30 2012 : 20:39:11
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First, how I do it:
SPOT - "OK" message to certain family and friends when we depart a location. "OK" message when we reach our destination. I also like having BoatUS towing assigned to the "help" button as they'll come and get you (or coordinate local response if out of range). To back SPOT up we have a sat phone and each of us has a GPS enabled PLB on our life vests.
People know that if they don't see that second "OK" message within 4-6 hours, something may be wrong. Also, this past trip we were attempting to hook up with Dan (Boatbum) so I added him to my "OK" message e-mail list. This allowed him to track where we were each day on our way around the Abacos. These messages are unlimited one-way with annual subscription.
Now, here's the real PITA kicker - The last two times we checked back in with Customs in FL (Finally got LBO this time) they informed us that they will eventually be REQUIRING FLOAT PLANS FOR RECREATIONAL VESSELS! Right now it's voluntary, but the agents said it will be mandatory in the near future. They even gave me two different phone numbers to use with LBO when checking back in; one if I filed a plan and one if I didn't. Check it out:
https://svrs.cbp.dhs.gov/
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--Kurt
17 knot cruise at 5mpg (3.5/gph). Two hulls are better than one! |
Edited by - mixman on Jul 30 2012 20:46:53 |
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Homeport: Chesapeake Bay
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missnmountains
RO# 22737
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Posted - Jul 30 2012 : 20:45:47
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Supposedly, under the LBO (Local Boater Option) plan we were to start filing float plans over a year ago. The system never has worked. Kurt is correct on his link, but when I tried, the on line system never has worked. Let's see what happens.
We use the Spot. My brother usually is the one making sure we arrive at our destination. I always carry a sat phone so that we can also contact him periodically.
Ken
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| 2008 58 Sedan Bridge |
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Homeport: Cape Coral, FL
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L. Keith
RO# 1615
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Posted - Jul 30 2012 : 20:53:52
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Use your S.S.B. Check in twice a day with a base station or another vessel.
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Homeport: N. Gulf of Mexico
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Silver Lining
RO# 29390
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Posted - Jul 30 2012 : 22:03:07
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Thanks for the helpful responses. Part of what precipitated this was we went from Nassau to Great Harbor, and when we arrived at Great Harbor they had no phone or internet for 3 days, in an area where phone/internet is usually available. Sometimes we fish on a passage and wind up getting in many hours later than expected.
The Spot may be the most cost effective solution to alert family when we leave and arrive. To be honest I really like the idea of being disconnected and out of contact, and the Spot will allow contact without having to make calls or send messages. But the satellite phone allows 2-way communications which would be very helpful if way offshore and a problem arises. I guess the satellite phone is the lowest price way for two way communication.
In the long run I would like to be able to get weather data via satellite as we had multiple islands this year with no internet when it is usually available. Next year we are thinking of going further down the island chain and in that case we need to improve our communications.
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-Rick
Viking Sport Cruiser 50FY
"Silver Lining" |
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Homeport: Chesapeake, MD
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Silver Lining
RO# 29390
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Posted - Jul 30 2012 : 22:06:58
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Kurt, we got the LBO cards a couple of years ago and they really make re-entering easy. Havent tried the CBP float plan site yet, but the same problem arises, if we make a change in plans and change our return dates, we have to have a reliable way to contact the CBP to change the float plan.
To complicate matters this year, my 4 month old laptop failed on the first week of the trip (still had my Iphone). I talked to Dell last night and the diagnosis is a hardware RAM failure.
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-Rick
Viking Sport Cruiser 50FY
"Silver Lining" |
Edited by - Silver Lining on Jul 30 2012 22:10:56 |
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Homeport: Chesapeake, MD
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mixman
RO# 25362
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Posted - Jul 30 2012 : 22:13:48
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quote:
Originally posted by Silver Lining
In the long run I would like to be able to get weather data via satellite as we had multiple islands this year with no internet when it is usually available. Next year we are thinking of going further down the island chain and in that case we need to improve our communications.
I'm not sure how far down the chain Sirius/XM satellites reach. Perhaps somebody can comment on that, but they work very well in the Abacos. A satellite phone would also give you data. I only get 9k of bandwidth on my Globalstar phone when using data, but it is quite enough to check weather via the numerous compressed weather data options.
I haven't gone SSB yet, but if you do, there's always Chris Parker and his forecasts. He's the expert. I think he might do e-mail too, which is fine via sat-phone.
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--Kurt
17 knot cruise at 5mpg (3.5/gph). Two hulls are better than one! |
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Homeport: Chesapeake Bay
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mixman
RO# 25362
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Posted - Jul 30 2012 : 22:22:06
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Not as reliable as a sat phone, but a BTC SIM card with a gsm cell booster and external antenna can work wonders. Do you have links to BTC cell coverage? I do if you want to look.
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--Kurt
17 knot cruise at 5mpg (3.5/gph). Two hulls are better than one! |
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Homeport: Chesapeake Bay
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aubv
RO# 16042
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Posted - Jul 30 2012 : 23:22:19
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Why not AIS?
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| 2001 23' BW Outrage for sale Minor Offshore 28 on order |
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Homeport: Lake Tashmoo
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Billylll
RO# 24494
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Posted - Jul 30 2012 : 23:39:37
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The sat phone is the bomb in my opinion but not what they did to the Fleet Broadband monthly low to no use plans. Almost insane at $70.00 a month wow I get 60 minutes of talk time and data at $13.00 a meg. I'm PO'ed because FB was to be the bomb and 2 years later they come out with true VSAT 3mbps DL and 1mbps UL and the plans are less expensive the kicker the terminal is $15 to $18k. I should have kept my TracPhone 252 sure the data is poor but who cares in an emergency?
Now a word about SSB since I'm a ham I have no marine SSB only ham radio. I can listen to the Marine SSB channels. Unless you know sunspots and propagation and your antenna can tune all the bands without interfering with other systems on your vessel it is very difficult to use and I wonder who is really listening other then perhaps the CG? But they seem to have operational problems with simple VHF FM communications I can not imagine sector Deleware Bay on SSB! The problem with SSB is you might reach somebody in Spain but not the US depending on the tgime of the day, then there is all that static and noise to deal with. Yes SSB with a good PACTOR modem is great but O find my low frequency NAVTEX reciever is great for NTMs and warnings but it is only one way.
We each have PLB's on our Mustangs, (2) 406MHz GPS EPIRB's, 4 handheld submersable VHF/FRS combination handheld radios, Ham SSB 80 meters through 70Cm (432MHz), every major US Cell carrier's modem to a router to a pair of access points, the Skipper FB-150 on Fleet, 2 Garmin VHF200 radios and a Navico NAIS300L class B transponder and the good old trust Fruno NAVTEX LF reciever. Cell phone amplifeirs that can be cabled in for WiMAX CLWR, LTE (700MHz) and 800/1900 MHz US cellular A & B carriers and A through F PCS. I have plenty of wide band hardwire Omni antennas for cellular. So now all I have to do is start cruising. My cellphones can be hooked up to my DECT6.0 cordless phone system it has provisions for 2 Bluetooth Cellphones to connect to it. I also have a SIP/VOIP box for when ever I have a good low latency data connection that works as a great 2nd phone line, I got rid of the SKYPE phone.
The Iridium Extreme or the Yellow Brick is the only 2 way text and positioning communications device we are missing.
Bill
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WirelessOne,
40 Mainship
Sedan Bridge
Little Egg, N.J. |
Edited by - Billylll on Jul 30 2012 23:45:42 |
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Homeport: Tuckerton, N.J.
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Billylll
RO# 24494
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Posted - Jul 30 2012 : 23:49:41
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quote:
Originally posted by aubv
Why not AIS?
AIS Class A or B is very short range only. I do like the new MOB approved SMRT AIS rigged Inflatable PFDs.
Bill
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WirelessOne,
40 Mainship
Sedan Bridge
Little Egg, N.J. |
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Homeport: Tuckerton, N.J.
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Billylll
RO# 24494
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Posted - Jul 30 2012 : 23:53:11
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quote:
Originally posted by mixman
Not as reliable as a sat phone, but a BTC SIM card with a gsm cell booster and external antenna can work wonders. Do you have links to BTC cell coverage? I do if you want to look.
Kurt my Verizon PANTEC UML290 USB modem/ to CradlePoint CTR25 has a setting for international GSM and LTE. I suppose that would work connected to one of my external antennas and using the SIP/VOIP box? I was cleaning out one of our storage facilities and just threw away 5 5 watt 900MHz CSI BiDirectional amplifiers that ran off of 5VDC. I never tought about my friends that travel "out back" in a boat. I'll have to see if I still have a few if anybody needs one they only work on the 900MHz GSM band.
Bill
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WirelessOne,
40 Mainship
Sedan Bridge
Little Egg, N.J. |
Edited by - Billylll on Jul 30 2012 23:56:19 |
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Homeport: Tuckerton, N.J.
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mixman
RO# 25362
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Posted - Jul 31 2012 : 06:04:20
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quote:
Originally posted by Billylll
Kurt my Verizon PANTEC UML290 USB modem/ to CradlePoint CTR25 has a setting for international GSM and LTE. I suppose that would work connected to one of my external antennas and using the SIP/VOIP box? I was cleaning out one of our storage facilities and just threw away 5 5 watt 900MHz CSI BiDirectional amplifiers that ran off of 5VDC. I never tought about my friends that travel "out back" in a boat. I'll have to see if I still have a few if anybody needs one they only work on the 900MHz GSM band.
Bill
[/quote]
Bill, I noticed my Pantech also has some options for global usage now. I'm not sure if it's locked or not like Verizon global phones are. If not, it should certainly work in the Bahamas, but I wouldn't plan much on VOIP as many times EDGE is about the best you'll find there. If the Pantech does HSPA, then high-speed is available in some locations. And those 900MHz amps should work as well. $30/month for a gig of data isn't too bad considering the location.
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--Kurt
17 knot cruise at 5mpg (3.5/gph). Two hulls are better than one! |
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Homeport: Chesapeake Bay
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When to file a float plan if going offshore?
