Insurance update...

C

Capt. Art

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As of today it's been 30 days since my loss.
I Just spoke to the insurance company. Thay say they are trying to get a break in the weather to send a diver down to examine the boat? (they found it) Funny since I gave them the EXACT GPS position it went down? I'm starting to wonder are they stalling? They have had weeks to look at it if they wanted to but it's possible that it took a while to organize with bad weather? They say the time (30 days) has not begun until they had a chance to see it? If that's true then what's to prevent them taking until next Summer? Appears to be a little foot dragging? I don't want to involve (and pay for) an attorney if a week or two is all that will be needed but If it's a stall? Opinions?
 
Money in their pocket is better to them than money in your pocket. Insurance companies will stall at every possible hiccup to pay a claim. I have a relative in the business. His words, not mine.

I don't think you will have to get a lawyer involved, however you do need to stay on top of them and let them know you are not going away. If possible, document the weather from the day of loss. That is one less thing they can use as an excuse. Do not expect anything to happen on weekends or holidays. Document everything. If by e-mail, get the header data.

HTH
 
Wow Art. I know nothing about this stuff. But I am really suprised they're sending a diver down. Didn't you say it was in something like 250ft of water? It is diveable but only by real pro's. Seems pretty extreme on their part. On the bright side, since we know you didn't do it, maybe they'll actually learn what did cause it and we'll all be wiser for it.
 
For the amount of money you are talking about, regardless of the circumstances such a claim would cause me to engage an attorney from day one. This is no ordinary loss.
 
The weather and conditions offshore have not been good the past few weeks, I can see why they haven't been abel to get down there.

One thing to consider is the divers ability to move about the boat with his dive gear and tank on, I wonder if they think they can get him in the engine room to do a look see.

Maybe they want to check the hull to see if there was a breach.
 
I'm hesitant to recommend a public insurance adjustor, as they take a cut of what they recover. However, if you suspect that you will not recover enough to cover your loss under terms of your policy, an adjustor may pay off for you.
 
Art, any correspondance from the underwriter concerning "Reservation of Rights". The use of a ROV/divers may be a simple confirmation that the vessel on the bottom is the vessel shown on the insurance policy. Underwriter's have an obligation to investigate each and every loss. As I said in an earlier post on this matter, a sudden, unexplained sinking, offshore in deep water, on a calm day, raises eyebrows in most claims departments. The fact that the vessel sank suddenly, without an explanation is evidence that the vessel was not "sea worthy" under the terms and conditions of the insurance policy. Sea Worthy vessels do not suddenly sink without an outside influence, such as heavy weather, striking, collision, bursting of boiler or breakage of shafts, fire and/or explosion.

I hope the underwriters will use a professional, commercial diving company. An ROV will show and video the wreck without using surface supplied mixed gas divers. That way a complete inspection can be carried out. If a scuba/nitrox diver tries to do the inspection the bottom time will be limited. Just because the vessel went underwater at a certain location does not mean it will end up on the bottom directly below that point.

You need to hire a COMPETENT Marine Surveyor that handles Underwriters work and have him/her work with your Underwriters Surveyor. Your guy should be in attendace, witness and document what is found during the inspection dive. You should also be talking to a COMPETENT Admiralty Attorney, experienced with Yacht Claims.
 
Ummmm.....BS. They are feeling you out to see if you suddenly get quiet.

Sorry, but to put a diver in 250fsw for a look see is not cake walk. I've been there.

You don't do this kind of thing casually, and if they do....then you have some freelance guy with the wrong credentials. Guaranteed. If they pull one of the typical NE pizza shirt stained guys to take a look see, you immediately want to get details of what the guy was breathing. Though things have changed over the years, there is a good chance they end up with somebody breathing a mix that will impair their judgement and therefore invalidate the findings. If they are SWIMMING, then claim judgement impaired as well. You want pictures. I'm honestly guessing that they don't even have a diver on call. A professional is going to want to bring a crew with them and have proper support. That costs money. Very strong chance that the insurance company would not want to put up the kind of money we are talking about. That's why the quasi sport crowd who are so good at killing each other at these depths run into so much problems. That along with the lack of professionalism, which again quite likely makes my point about whether anyone could trust the "findings" they came up with in the first place.

In a private sense, yeah I've risked my neck to crawl into a wreck at depths way outside the sport diving limits. If someone was paying me though, if that was my motivation, I'd have a barge over my head. It's just a completely different motivation. Crawling into a wreck with all the very real entanglement hazards with anything less for money....you got to be kidding me.

So again, either the insurance folks are getting an opnion not worth the paper its written on, or, they are bluffing. I'm betting the later. The fact that they are re-writing the definition of 30 days is enough by itself. Get a lawyer. I'd also be worried about whether if they are bluffing to see how you respond whether NOT getting a lawyer sends the wrong message. You want them to understand that you have nothing to fear about what they are going to find, but insist that if they DO go get a look see that you won't play nice with their findings unless they in fact hire a qualified "professional" crew that is not composed of glorified recreational divers with cereal box credentials from any of the recreational agencies. These guys are not qualified to change the oil in your car. I know. Saw many of them perish. Unfortunately, they made new ones to replace the old ones. Same story.
 
I've also been told that the boat is in only 150-ft of water??? Not the 287-ft that I saw on my last depth reading? I have no idea if this is true or false & I could care less. I'm just trying to determine what I should do or consider at this point?
 
It's a stall tactic. Every company will do it with big claim issues. If you get this straightened out within another month or two, I'd be very surprised.

A co-worker of mine had a substantial loss on his shore house over the winter when a pipe burst. It took out the entire 1st floor and everything in it. The house was built by his grandfather and the wood work can't be replaced. He has been fighting the issue since the Dec '08/Jan'09 time frame. The insurance company just got back to him this past week or so with a low ball offer. It's all part of the game. Meanwhile, the shore house could not be occupied by renters or by his families that typically use it.

Again, if your loss is wrapped up quickly, I'd be very surprised. My only advice is to document every call, every email, every fax, etc so that you have some sort of evidence in case you need it. Be persistent. Call several times a week because they will play the 'oh it was sitting on Tom's desk and he didn't look at it' routine.
 
A claim on a home owner's policy and a yacht policy are two, entirely different things, don't even try to compare them. Actually, Art, under most yacht policies all you have to prove is that you suffered a "Fortuitous Loss", after that the ball is in the underwriters court. If they mishandle the claim/loss, the underwriters will open themselves to a possible Bad Faith Claim.
 
---- and who's paying the diver and does the diver represent your interests or the underwriter's and does he want any more work from the underwriter?
 
Isn't it possible that they just want to verify that the boat they insure is on the bottom and not in columbia?
 
I just wrote them an email saying that i am expecting to be paid from the date of loss on my entire boat loan the Per Diem interest rate of the loan and the full balance owed me to be calculated at the same interest rate. I'm asking for a confirmation of this. I think that's only fair? I'm not causing any delay?
 
quote:
Originally posted by L. Keith

A claim on a home owner's policy and a yacht policy are two, entirely different things, don't even try to compare them. Actually, Art, under most yacht policies all you have to prove is that you suffered a "Fortuitous Loss", after that the ball is in the underwriters court. If they mishandle the claim/loss, the underwriters will open themselves to a possible Bad Faith Claim.

Click to expand...


It might be different but unfortunately, all insurance companies have no issue taking your money, they just have a problem giving it back to you.
 
I agree with GeeBee, Art. I'd get a lawyer on board right away. A letter from one providing an acceptable, to you, time line might provide needed motivation.
 
Attorney's take at least 33 1/3 percent or more of your Gross Claim, plus Expenses, so make sure you are in a gun fight with the underwriter before you sign on the dotted line. The underwriter confirming the location and the identity of the vessel on the bottom is not at all uncommon and should be expected from a compentent underwriter. The cost of the underwater inspection comes out to the underwriter's pocket, but you (and/or your representative) have the right to be in attendance to see what they see. Art good luck on collecting the interest rate on your loan. If you have an agreed value policy, that amount is all you will recieve.
 
I guess I don’t see what a lawyer can do to expedite the settlement. If their offer isn’t acceptable then a lawyer can sue but insurance companies aren’t afraid of lawyers, they employ many of them.
The state insurance commission however does care and have influence over settlement times.
 
If you were outside of your policy Navigational Limits at the time of loss, then a positive identification of the vessel/wreck and a confirmed position of the wreck will be very important to the underwriters. Art, are you sure you have not received correspondance from the underwriter stating "we reserve the right to..." or "all rights are reserved..." or anything along that line?
 
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