Propane Refrigerator?

One issue is the need to keep an absorption refrigerator vertical or very nearly so.

The process uses no pumps, but rather convection etc so remaining upright is a requirement. And that is the primary reason you rarely see them on boats ( as far as I can tell. ). Note that there may be air circulating fans circulating air inside or cooling fins outside, but the actual "heat moving" process is mechanical pump free.

Using a compressed heavier-than-air gaseous fuel is more of a "boating systems safety" issue. That is, if you are comfortable in having built in gaseous fuel lines at all, then this might be a viable option, IF you have a boat that will remain level under most conditions ( ie: houseboat, in protected,waters ).
 
quote:
Originally posted by Radioactive

Using a compressed heavier-than-air gaseous fuel is more of a "boating systems safety" issue. That is, if you are comfortable in having built in gaseous fuel lines at all, then this might be a viable option, IF you have a boat that will remain level under most conditions ( ie: houseboat, in protected,waters ).

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LOTS of boats, yachts, houseboats, etc. have propane systems already onboard, from the factory, for cooking stoves and ovens. So, why would tapping to an already existing system pose more of a threat? Apparently propane systems can meet ABYC standards or the factories wouldn't be installing them in production boats ....... or so it would seem to me.

Bob
 
quote:
Originally posted by rnbenton

LOTS of boats, yachts, houseboats, etc. have propane systems already onboard, from the factory, for cooking stoves and ovens. So, why would tapping to an already existing system pose more of a threat? Apparently propane systems can meet ABYC standards or the factories wouldn't be installing them in production boats ....... or so it would seem to me.
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Yes they do. Mine has one for the stove/oven.

For your light reading enjoyment, here is a link to the ABYC propane standards for boats:

http://www.abycinc.org/committees/A-01.pdf

As I recall, you cannot "tap into" the system, each appliance must be fed by a dedicated line with no connections inside the boat except at the appliance.

My propane sysrtem is factory installed and ABYC compliant. There is a switch at the galley that operates a solenoid in the propane locker (outside the boat). Propane is only available to the stove when the switch is on. For a refrigerator, it would have to be on 24/7.
 
propane cooking is great and the gas can be well controlled and only when actually cooking. Always on automatic refer is a very different issue IMO. A nice safe diesel boat then becomes a potential proble.
 
quote:
Originally posted by rawidman

quote:
Originally posted by rnbenton

LOTS of boats, yachts, houseboats, etc. have propane systems already onboard, from the factory, for cooking stoves and ovens. So, why would tapping to an already existing system pose more of a threat? Apparently propane systems can meet ABYC standards or the factories wouldn't be installing them in production boats ....... or so it would seem to me.
Click to expand...


Yes they do. Mine has one for the stove/oven.

For your light reading enjoyment, here is a link to the ABYC propane standards for boats:

http://www.abycinc.org/committees/A-01.pdf

As I recall, you cannot "tap into" the system, each appliance must be fed by a dedicated line with no connections inside the boat except at the appliance.

My propane sysrtem is factory installed and ABYC compliant. There is a switch at the galley that operates a solenoid in the propane locker (outside the boat). Propane is only available to the stove when the switch is on. For a refrigerator, it would have to be on 24/7.

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There is a totally different ABYC standard for gas appliances other than cooking stoves. it si A-26 and I have ordered it from ABYC. Tried to find and download it online but I got it cheaper ordering the printed version.

I'll let you know what is says when i get it and read it.

Bob
 
The important part is to be safe. You and I probably can't imagine the things that might go wrong, but some time, some where there was a situation that might have destroyed property or resulted in injury or death. That's what we want to avoid.
 
Looks like this project continues to be well researched.

It looked good on paper........

be smart, comfortable and most of all SAFE in your decision.

RWS
 
It really is about comfort level sometimes, isn't it? Would I put a propane refrigerator on my current boat? No, I wouldn't be comfortable with it. The boat came with a propane stove, but the locker and hose connections (hose clamps, not crimped) were not to ABYC standards. The boat is built in Europe and meets European standards for such. I wasn't "comfortable" with it and removed it. The locker, which isn't completely sealed off from the cabin, makes a great place to store our lines.

That being said, I'm also not comfortable with inboard gas boats. I think inboard diesel is fine, but inboard gas is not something I'm comfortable with (especially built-in gasoline powered generators). Does that mean they're bad and shouldn't be legal? Nope. It's just my personal choice to not own such.

Then again, I'm also anti mono-hull :-)
 
+1 L. Keith. The flame has to be absolutely vertical because it has to say between the windings of the coils. You can level an RV with the jacks, but you can't keep a boat level. It will not work in a boat.
 
quote:
Originally posted by GeeBee

+1 L. Keith. The flame has to be absolutely vertical because it has to say between the windings of the coils. You can level an RV with the jacks, but you can't keep a boat level. It will not work in a boat.
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Well, that is fairly uninformed and just not completely accurate.

1. Newer units, built since 2009, according to the Dometic factory tech I spoke with, pitching and rolling do NOT keep them from working. True older units pretty much had to be "table level" to work most efficiently. But this just is not the case with newer units. Not all RV's have leveling systems so some degree of tilt wil still work. On a boat the tilt is even of lesser concern because the tilt is not constant.

2. I would have no need to run on propane when underway, that's what alternators are for. Also, I would have no reason to run it when at the dock, that's what shore power is for. So, the only time I would want to run it on propane is when on the hook, in protected water. Maybe some people anchor over night where it is pitching and rolling, but not me. But, even at that, the tilt is not constant so has very little effect. If the propane refrigerator is installed "fairly level" when the boat is not in motion it will work fine and some water motion will not effect it.

Plus, I went to an RV dealer yeaterday and crawled oll over a couple of motorhomes with propane refrigerators installed. All of them have a safety device which prevents the frige from running on propane when the motorhome is in motion. Once the engine is started the frige automatically shuts off the propane and runs on 12 volt.

So to say "it will not work on a boat" is simply an over statement. Yes, there are considerations, just like every other aspect of being on a boat. But due diligence and caution can give a very favorable result.

From all I have researched so far the key issues is installation and the key concerns with that are 1) venting and 2) heat build up around the burner and coil. There is a ABYC standard (A-26) that covers this. (If it "will not work" why would there be an ABYC standard for it?)

Now, it may work out that the proper installation process and requirements will simply not be practical for my boat. I don't fully know and will not know until I get my copy of the ABYC standard, which I ordered yesterday. But, I do know this, my research has revealed that there are FAR nmore boats out there with propane refrigerators than I thought and over the past 3-4 decades they have an excellent safety record.

Bob
 
When all else fails, read the directions, even if you have to download 'em first.

The flame does NOT have to be "absolutely" level, just "nearly so", "most" of the time. RV fridges can operate with the RV going down the road and rocking all over the place. The same thing with a boat. A sailboat would present a problem as it could stay heeled over for hours. A powerboat shouldn't be a problem.

However every propane fridge I've ever seen on a boat was installed on a houseboat, above the waterline, against an outside bulkhead, with grilles for fresh air as well as an exhaust vent or stack. If this isn't possible you might want to rethink the installation. I'm guessing that with a properly installed propane fridge, the propane part of the system are sealed off from the inside of the boat.

All that outside venting could present a problem from SPRAY, on an ocean-going boat. I would visit an RV or houseboat dealership and take a good look at the way their fridges are installed.

I wanted to install a propane fridge when I rebuilt my boat, but the layout of the galley was not conducive, so I installed an AC fridge and an inverter instead.
 
If installed correctly and maintained, it should be safe. Adding a propane gas detector(s) would be a must have.
 
Well that is a new one on me, but that said, I'm not real keen on sleeping on a boat whatever the source of fuel with an open flame. Cooking might be one thing, but it is a "stand watch" proposition". Might as well light kerosene lanterns too.
 
quote:
Originally posted by GeeBee

Might as well light kerosene lanterns too.

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You mean like they did for several hundred years on sailing vessels? :)

Bob
 
I was about to put a "cost reduced" Salt water circulating and Fan cooled Refer in my old Chris craft.

Since Salt water in AK is near 40 degrees most of the year, maybe up to 50 in the heat of the Summer, I'd just circulate the Ocean through the coils in the Fridge. A fan to pull air out of the Fridge.
the Combination should keep that fridge down to 40 degrees inside.

Every once in awhile I'd have to fire up one of the engines to re-charge the house battery's.
 
Not a bad plan if the sea temperature is cold enough. Wouldn't work too well here in Florida though :(
 
quote:
Originally posted by stmbtwle

Not a bad plan if the sea temperature is cold enough. Wouldn't work too well here in Florida though :(

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Yes!!! Finally something us boaters in the Northeast can hold over the heads of you FL boaters.
 
I just had to replace my 10 year old 3 way refrig in my travel trailer due to an ammonia leak in the cooling unit. It is just a normal RV sized frig, I think 7 cu ft. With shipping and tax it was $1,300.00, which I thought was a lot for a disposable frig. Evidently, the RV guy said 10 years is doing pretty good, leaks in the ammonia system are the most common cause of failure and they cannot be repaired. They are filled and sealed at the factory and not serviceable. He also said that propane is corrosive to the tubing and seams of the ammonia bottle which accelerate the wear. So, I guess using the 12v 120v electric heating coil would extend the life of the frig.

So, I guess my point here, Bob, is that considering the initial investment, the life expectancy in addition to the corrosive salt atmosphere in which it will be used are all things that should be thought about and compared to the advantages of a propane unit over a freon unit.

No solutions or recommendations one way or the other, just thoughts. Good luck.
 
I too am somewhat familiar with propane fridges from the RV world. Rnbenton ha a unique idea if he already has propane on board. My concern would be the cooling efficiency with the wave action. The stuff in the tube was not meant to be going up and down based on wave action. Any decision you make I am sure will be well thought out as I know you are reasonable practical and concerned about safety but not a safety NAZI.
 
Wow, still getting responses from a thread started in May of 2012. :)

Bob
 
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