Dried ? out teak - solutions ?

Stain, 2 coats of full strength Pettit Clear Sealer and 12 sanded coats of heavy, unthinned Pettit BAK-V-SPAR. Good American traditional spar varnish. Works for me and some other guys I know on the classic CC forum. Some of them show their boats, too. This is our boat. Being able to keep the boat in a covered slip makes all of the difference.
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I'm not sure any Cetol will look as good as Yzer's boat. Beautiful! I haven't seen anything give the same depth and gloss as spar varnish.
 
Cetol definitely will never look as good as Yzer's boat. I will agree with you, praetorian, it's nothing like traditional finishes. But for a low maintenance compromise, not bad.

My mistress is very demanding, I almost have more work than I can handle as it is, so re-doing her teak just isn't an option...
 
"but I've never seen varnish hold up well on teak."

You know I've heard people say this time and time again while all the while myself and most every refinisher I know has been using varnish on teak for decades with few if any problems. It holds up just fine on teak for years if applied properly and with proper maintenance.
 
I have varnished floors and walls in my cabins that is well over 3 years old and hasn't been touched. Because it gets very little light, it's like new.

I'll be putting 4 coats of varnish on my salon and galley floors now (first coat is on, but hasn't dried yet. In this weather it takes a couple days). I don't expect to have to add another coat for probably 3 years because of the screens on the salon.

Adding a maintainence coat isn't really too much work. All you need is the scuff sand the surface (actually the hardest part is to sand without sanding too much off). I really enjoy painting the varnish.

What I'm finding hard right now is re-veneering the countertops. I have all the teak veneer and I've repaired some of the damaged areas, but colour matching is a pain (still haven't got it perfect.)

When I'm done it will look fantastic.

I agree that Cetol is a good compromise for easy maintaining. If it makes you happy, then it's cool. To me, nothing looks better than varnish.
 
I've done a LOT a lot of varnishing but never had to varnish teak, so I learned a lot from the teak varnishers on this thread. If anyone has photos of an exterior teak varnishing job that's been maintained for five years or more, I'd like to see it.

When I'm building varnish coats I don't sand the first coat of sealer, it's too thin. The next coat of sealer get a light sanding with 220 grit. The first four or five coats of varnish that go on top of that get light sanding. At about coat 4 or 5, the varnish gets a hard sanding to bring down the high spots and make a flat surface. After another 4 lightly sanded coats another hard sanding will be needed to flatten the varnish again. That's how you get a flat-looking deep glossy varnish.
 
That sounds like 9 - 10 coats of varnish....not quite 15, but close!
 
8-12 coats is minimum if you want the varnish to have a deep, professional look. It's also the minimum number of varnish coats if you want a good UV stabilized varnish finish that will hold up on the exterior. Even with 12 coats (preferred) for exterior varnish, you will have to recoat as needed. For me, that's one and sometimes two new sanded coats a year. For boats berthed in the open, it's more often. For interior use, varnish may last many years between recoats depending on wear.

I think a lot of people get confused about what a "recoat" means. When recoating varnish you don't take all of the old varnish off and start over from scratch with bare wood. You just use 220 grit sandpaper to remove the surface of your last varnish coat. This is a light sanding: most of the old top coat stays on, but the surface is completely removed. That's covered with one or two coats of fresh varnish.

When I varnished the exterior from bare wood I did the stain, sealer and four varnish coats the first summer. That held up over the winter and I followed up with four more coats the next spring. After that, it was yearly recoats most every fall. I actualy skipped some years.
 
Yzer, that's kind of funny. I've never varnished anything but teak!

Have you ever used the clear silica beads to make an area non skid?

I'm still working out application methods for the silica beads. I've tried mixing the beads into the varnish container as Epifanes recommends. It works, but it can cause uneven distribution.

What I'm finding works best (in testing), is putting a coat of varnish then sprinkling the beads over the area from a salt shaker. Wait an hour or 2 and then recoat again. The problem I see is that I don't want to cover the entire surface with beads.

Another method I'd heard of was to keep some of the sanding dust from the floor and sprinking it over the final or 2nd last coat. I've also read people leaving the last dust from the last sanding on the floor and varnishing over. I'm a little skeptical of how this would look, but it's interesting.

One thing I found really time consuming was the stripping of the floor. The holley strips are actually higher than the teak. The height difference is supposed to give it non-skid. I had to hand sand each strip individually!

I'm going to be sick of varnish by the time this project is over. The pictures of your boat, Yzer, gives me just enough motivation right now to continue! Thanks.

PS. My wife is helping me do the work. In fact, in the last week, she's done most of it since I just had a kidney stone removed. I pity the fool who tries to walk into our boat next summer with shoes on ;)

Have you ever tried the Epifanes varnish? How does it compare with the Petit?
 
I looked at many boats finished with Epifanes varnish, including boats finished at Sierra Boat Company on Lake Tahoe. Many of their prize-winning boats are shown at the Concours d'Elegance that they host every August. They use Epifanes varnish exclusively.

I only used Epifanes once. That was when I varnished test pieces before deciding on the varnish I'd use on the boat.

Epifanes is great traditional varnish, but on the old boats I like an older style amber varnish like the Pettit. Epifanes is pretty clear and I don't think the old dark stains look right with it. The amber colored Pettit BAK-V-SPAR looks warmer and richer. I have a section of unmolested original finish inside the helm station that's a dead color match for my new finish. Except for the mast and flag poles all of the stain on my boat is pretty dark. The neutral stain used on those pieces was originally finished with amber varnish.

I don't like the look of Pettit BAK on unstained wood. It looks plain yellow with time like an old grade school desk. Epifanes looks much better on unstained and modern blonde stains.

The Pettit BAK-V-SPAR is reputed to have the longest exterior life of any traditional varnish, but I think Epifanes has a slight edge in initial gloss. The other thing I like about the Pettit: it has the longest-lasting wet edge and the longest drying time of any varnish out there. That's a big plus if you're varnishing large areas. Long drying time allows me to varnish well even in 90 degree heat.

I like to varnish decks most of all. Flat, horizonal and nothing varnishes faster. That's when I pull out the 4" brush. You need good knee pads for the sanding, though.

I wear sneakers, deck shoes and hiking boots on the deck and the varnish holds up amazingly well to foot traffic. Unfortunately, stilletto heels ever touch my deck.

No experience here with the silica beads. I don't see why it wouldn't work but your practice passes on test pieces is a great idea. There is probably a knack to mixing the beads and varnish in a mixing jar and loading the brush just right.
 
Greetings and thanks for tremendous amout of information. Because teak I am concerned with is exterior (all teak inside is beautiful with one teak oil wipedown a year - max) and about 1/2 is for underfoot I will stick with teak oil and just coat after coat until it starts to take less and less. Is there a "thicker" brand that sucks into the wood better for longer last and less coating. Is there a trick to get the teak to "suck it in" better? Any help would be appreiciated and , again, thanks for all input.
 
I know a guy who uses red transmission oil on his exterior teak decks. The finished product looks fine, but I have no idea of the pros and cons of using it. He says the oil really soaks in and therefore does not leave a slippery surface.
 
I have also heard the red transmission fluid method of oiling teak. Came across it on the internet. I have a Slickcraft 24 footer trimmed with current varnish teak but it is all beat up, faded and peeling. I am going to strip and try the transmission fluid.
 
full strength Cetol is too orange but Cetol Light followed by CEtol Gloss is a good compromise. The big advantage is that you don't have to sand between coats... I have 100+ft of rails and there is no way I'm going to apply 7 to 10 coats of varnish sanding between each !

For wider surfaces though, like doors or cabinets, i agree that Cetol isnt ideal as the wider surface seem to increases the orangy look.
 
quote:
Originally posted by amer2828

Greetings and thanks for tremendous amout of information. Because teak I am concerned with is exterior (all teak inside is beautiful with one teak oil wipedown a year - max) and about 1/2 is for underfoot I will stick with teak oil and just coat after coat until it starts to take less and less. Is there a "thicker" brand that sucks into the wood better for longer last and less coating. Is there a trick to get the teak to "suck it in" better? Any help would be appreiciated and , again, thanks for all input.

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Beware. Most of the folks who are telling you to apply teak oil externally, probably don't know what they are talking about. If you apply it once every 6 months, it will do what you witnessed. Look okay for a few weeks and then fade. If you apply it continually, you will get away with a few months. That's when disaster strikes. See at some point the little micro booger organisms will start to feed on all that oil and its going to turn and ugly black moldy goo looking color. Then your back to stripping and its a big job. While teak oil externally is "possible", its about the most high maintenance choice you can possibly make, way ahead of cetol (fake tan) or varnish (classic).

The theory of "too little oil" and "catching up" is completely wrong. If you take a piece of sandpaper and hit the teak with it and don't hit nice looking oily teak almost immediately after getting the surface off, its done. Teak really doesn't lose its oil over many many years, so if that is the case you might not have teak at al. That or, just very bad teak. Either way, if that's the problem the teak will be splitting and need to be replaced.

Chances are, you just need to refinish it, or let it go grey.

bp
 
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