FINALLY! New boat...revarnishing?

M

mutiny

Member
Joined
Jul 30, 2001
RO Number
5547
Messages
4
Looks like we'll be picking up a 1950's Penn Yan this weekend. 2 foot itis worked in reverse and we're going from the 17' Mutiny to a 13' PY. Of course we sold the Mutiny (Bayliner bowrider...82 I think) a while ago and I don't think you can count the Custom Craft Sea Ray wreck we briefly had (free boat...we never even started the resto, but I am hooked on fin boats now-we did sell it for a few hundred $$ so it hopefully went on to be restored).

Our new old boat is in pretty good shape, but the wood could use a revarnish. The bottom paint could probably use a refreshing too. We'll do both before we float it just to keep it in good shape. Never had a wood boat before...so...Aside from stripping and sanding, will there be some sort of filler we'll need? I will have pics after we bring her home this weekend. Where do you get marine paint & varnish? Boats US?
 
You can get the varnish at West Marine other local ships stores or through the internet.

You don't normally need any filler. Once you get the wood stripped down, cleaned and sanded properly the firsts couple of coats of varnish should be thinned by 50%. Then the next couple of coats by say 25%. The next 8-10+ coats you would only use as little thinner as needed to get the varnish to flow out nicely.

There are a number of different varnish or varnish like products you could use. Everybody has their favorites. I like Epifanes as a natural varnish, Awlgrip as a two part poly and Cetol if you like the look of it for longevity and easy of use.

You can also look at applying clear epoxy as your base coats before applying any varnish or two part poly. Epoxy of course bonds to the bare wood very strongly and fills the grain quickly as well.
 
That's a lotta coats with no garage to keep the sand flies away, lol. Thank you for the help, seems Epifanes gets a lot of good reviews. I like the idea of tung oil, I have natural wood floors that we use tung oil on.
 
I ve become a fan of epoxy (west 105 with 207 hardener) and clear Awlgrip.... You can roll all 3 coats of epoxy in one day and then 3 coats of Awlgrip 24 hours apart with no or minimal sanding. Last a lot longer than varnish and no sanding between coats. Just don't roll the eopxy in the sun or it will bubble. Use 3" foam rollers and tip with foam brush To remove the roller bubles

Cetol isn't bad but even the light has an orange tint. There is a new clear I haven't used.

Bristol is pretty good, again no sanding between coats, and last 2 to 3 years
 
quote:
Originally posted by Capt. Bill1

You can get the varnish at West Marine other local ships stores or through the internet.

You don't normally need any filler. Once you get the wood stripped down, cleaned and sanded properly the firsts couple of coats of varnish should be thinned by 50%. Then the next couple of coats by say 25%. The next 8-10+ coats you would only use as little thinner as needed to get the varnish to flow out nicely.

There are a number of different varnish or varnish like products you could use. Everybody has their favorites. I like Epifanes as a natural varnish, Awlgrip as a two part poly and Cetol if you like the look of it for longevity and easy of use.

You can also look at applying clear epoxy as your base coats before applying any varnish or two part poly. Epoxy of course bonds to the bare wood very strongly and fills the grain quickly as well.

Click to expand...


Bill covered everything I had in mind. I use mineral spirits to step on the Epifanes, and Cetol...well, if you think you look good with spray-on tans, you'll like the look of Cetol. That's the nicest thing I can say about that particular product.
 
quote:
Originally posted by PascalG

I ve become a fan of epoxy (west 105 with 207 hardener) and clear Awlgrip.... You can roll all 3 coats of epoxy in one day and then 3 coats of Awlgrip 24 hours apart with no or minimal sanding. Last a lot longer than varnish and no sanding between coats. Just don't roll the eopxy in the sun or it will bubble. Use 3" foam rollers and tip with foam brush To remove the roller bubles

Cetol isn't bad but even the light has an orange tint. There is a new clear I haven't used.

Bristol is pretty good, again no sanding between coats, and last 2 to 3 years

Click to expand...


Does the epoxy/Awlgrip bring out the character of the wood like Epifanes? I'm getting ready to put the Bristol Skiff in the garage to strip down and refinish the mahogany. Was just going to go with the same methods I've always used (heavily stepped on Epifanes for a few coats, slightly less cut for a few coats, etc.), but I'm always up for trying something new.
 
Yes I think it does. High gloss and depth,

But where you are, two coats of varnish probably last 5 years :)
 
Epoxy and Awlgrip end up looking like varnish and they have great longevity. Awlgrip or a similar product is pretty much what all the big boats use these days. But the products are not cheap and Awlgrip can be tricky for a beginner to work with. It is also harder to touch up any nicks or dings you may get in the finish.

I like Bristol as well but I've been told by a painter/ varnisher friend of mine that they are out of business. But I have not checked on that myself yet. Have you bought any recently Pascal?
 
quote:
Originally posted by mutiny

That's a lotta coats with no garage to keep the sand flies away, lol.

Click to expand...


As any good varnisher will tell you, "your last coat is never your last coat" so there is always one more to go to sand the bugs out. :-)
 
This topic has really helped me better understand what I am going to do with the Teak that's on my soon to be Trawler. There isn't much but I was considering painting it I know yuck!
Now I'm going to probably follow Pascal's suggestions.
Bill
 
No I haven't. I used it on my handrails about 3 or 4 years ago and just sanded it all off two days ago and rolled the first two coats of epoxy. Will do two more this week then Awlgrip.

Actually I find Awlgrip much easier to apply than epoxy and no harder than varnish. It levels very nicely. I roll it with small disposable white foam rollers then tip it with a high quality brush. For the epoxy I tip with disposable foam brushes.
 
quote:
Originally posted by PascalG

Yes I think it does. High gloss and depth,

But where you are, two coats of varnish probably last 5 years :)

Click to expand...


That's true - don't have to worry about UV exposure more than two or three weeks out of the year.

Poor boat has been neglected. Didn't even go in the water last year, it's just been sitting in my side driveway getting rained on and collecting dirt.
 
quote:
Originally posted by PascalG

Actually I find Awlgrip much easier to apply than epoxy and no harder than varnish.

Click to expand...


But then you are not a beginner. :-)

Which Awlgrip product are you using?
 
I hate painting and suck at it :)

G3005 high gloss clear, with H3002 brush converter
 
Brush work, application are all important but most bright work fails because of moisture getting under the varnish or even epoxy and creating a vapor that lifts the varnish. Sealing and filling all edges, seams and hardware mounts is key to success.

Cap rail varnish often fail because the underside is exposed and gets wet. Assembled structures such as gratings and steering wheels with all their joints are very difficult to seal and IMO swim platforms and gratings should be left unvarnished to protect the sanity of the owner. I have never used epoxy but it may do a better job gluing assembled structures together but the work to strip them back down would make me cautious.

Any looseness or movement in a joint or fitting is a quick route to failure of the varnish.
 
Tip from someone with experience.
1. Use a "squirt" sprayer bottle.
2. After wetting the varnish coat, wet sand with 400 grit wet paper.
3. Wash down to clean surface and then wipe down with denatured alcohol. Apply varnish.
4. You can eliminate a lot of coats by using the Petit HiBuild varnish.
5. Hold a lamp close to the finished surface to find drips and voids. Keep varnishing until you eliminate them.
Good luck.
 
Pascal - do you get the UV protection from the epoxy or the awlgrip? I was told you can awlgrip over vanish too, the vanish provides the UV and the awlgrip added abrasion protection (but I can't remember if I have that right). Would your method be too slippery for a swim platform? I did Cetol, lasted a while, but not that happy with the color, and the last couple years I just oiled (has a sunbrella cover made to protect when not in use)but it got away from me last year, so I'm thinking varnish...but epoxy/awlgrip sounds interesting. Thanks.
 
quote:
Originally posted by rblochli

Pascal - do you get the UV protection from the epoxy or the awlgrip? I was told you can awlgrip over vanish too, the vanish provides the UV and the awlgrip added abrasion protection (but I can't remember if I have that right). Would your method be too slippery for a swim platform? I did Cetol, lasted a while, but not that happy with the color, and the last couple years I just oiled (has a sunbrella cover made to protect when not in use)but it got away from me last year, so I'm thinking varnish...but epoxy/awlgrip sounds interesting. Thanks.

Click to expand...


Cetol is spray tan for boats. It looks horrendous. It's only redeeming characteristic is that it builds up to a thick layer quickly, but it still looks like hell.

TL;DR: Cetol is the wood finish equivalent of a fat chick with a spray tan.
 
West has one clear epoxy with some UV protection. But the majority of the protection comes from the Awlgrip. Epoxy with Awlgrip over it would be to slippery for a swimatform. Unless perhaps you put some nonskid in the final coats of Awlgrip.

While I've refinished a number of swim platforms for people over the years, I think the best thing to do with them is keep them natural and clean with no finish on them.
 
Mutiny - did you do your varnish work? I have little experience applying varnish (other than on some teak furniture), but lots of experience with the options and results with all the bright work on my boats that is maintained by my yard. I agree with what's been said about Cetol. My yard has a ton of experience and does top of the line work, and they use Epiphanes, for what it's worth. The West epoxy looks good and is tempting because you don't have to maintain it as much as varnish. But it's a b!tch to strip, so you really have to be careful to maintain it enough so that you never have any failure areas. And that can be tough to do. My yard refuses to work with it. Also, no matter where you live, you always have to do some sanding and reapply coats of varnish - the sun and salt will eat at it, and as has even mentioned, if you don't maintain it you will get failure areas and moisture will get in there and you will need to strip it to fix.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top