Opinions on '89-'90 300 Sundancers

S

SCORPIO

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Jun 1, 2001
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4810
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966
Looking to move up in size (from 26' with 8' beam). I realize this is an older boat but the budget will not permit me to look at late model boats, (Two kids heading for college over the next few years). We liked the layout of the 340 SD but the size is a bit too big for our area, and the fuel condumption could become an issue at todays prices. I've been looking at 300 SDs as an alternative. they seem to have a similar layout only smaller and lighter. The merc alpha one drives should give it better performance than the vee drives on the 340s. Are there any know trouble spots with these boats? Anyone on here have a similar year 300? I'd like to know what to watch out for before we start looking seriously at alot of different boats.
Thanks
 
I'm confused. Your profile says you have a 42 Sea Ray and your post says you are stepping up from a 26. Is this for you or a fellow boater. Need more info.

What is he/she/you looking for. Speed? Speed costs. Slow express cruisers are flat boring. What is the price, the desired speed, the engines, the desired accommodations, local flotsam and jetsam, maintenance budget, mechanical aptitude and human flexibility, generator required, etc, etc, etc....

If I may offer a personal comparison.

I currently own a 1999/2000/2007 Sea Ray 330 Sundancer w/ a 6.5 Westerbeke gennie. She is one of the last 99 hulls built; she has a 2000 interior and 2007 engines. I used to have a 2001 Regal 2465 and toted a Honda 2000iu on the platform. Comparing gas consumption, the Sundancer is a pig. Comparing accommodations, the Regal pales in comparison. For my needs, a combination of the two would be the perfect boat.

I'm willing to bet the members here could help you pick the perfect boat if you provided more info.

My choice of older Sea Rays was the 360 "T" Top. I don't know why, but I always found that to be one sexy boat. Match it to a set of newer EFI Crusaders or Yanmars and you have one kickass 4 season cruiser.
 
Comparing gas consumption? A single engine 2465 with a 330? How is that even a comparison? Much like comparing a 40 foot diesel pusher RV with a truck camper!! When you say "pig" what does that mean? What is the difference in mpg? There are too many variables and nothing concrete in the statement other than "pig"! If it's that bad, sell it and return to the 2465! Sorry, I'm off my soapbox.

We have a 1989 30 footer and we love it. We trailer it all over the place in the Northwest. It's like any other boat, if it's well maintained it will be a great boat. Get it surveyed and let the owner know that he'll probably get to pay for anything big or small that needs to be addressed in the survey. Typically these old boats still have the original halon fire extinguisher that needs to be replaced. The rest is just a matter of how well previous owners maintained it and overall condition. I did the same research and nothing came up as far as "issues" to look out for. The Sea Rays in this vintage have to have the long window rebedded since it can leak. Neither the 250 or the 300 that we own leak, but I know it's something I need to watch out for. At this age, shift cables may need to be replaced. After 20 years on the 250 I finally had to replace one of them upper or lower, I can't remember. The alphas are a great drive! We have one in the 250 mated with a 454 Magnum and we've never had any problems with it. We just change the oil and the impeller. I never slam the throttle down either.

The 300 handles much better than the 250 that we own. We spend far less time manipulating the trim tabs like we do on the 250. It banks and turns more accurately than the 250 which can slide a bit depending on the trim tabs, engine trim and weight distribution. The 11 foot beam is SOOOO nice on the water and at the dock. It's more stable all around. The engine access is a little tight in between, but still manageable. I hope I NEVER have to swap out the bilge pump! I think we'd hire a midget or Yao Ming to turn the screws! I also like the fact that it is still a true Sea Ray in production BEFORE the Brunswick take over. I like the style and lines better than the new euro bubble designs too. That's just personal preference and has no bearing on the boat. We still have the original Sunbrella, but the threads are rather brittle so we are getting all the seams restitched.

If you have any questions, I'll watch the thread and try to answer them. The best part is that we don't have any payments! It's about 1/4 or less than buying new or 3 - 5 years old. If I had to put new twin engines in it, I'm still WAY ahead money wise compared to the depreciation in the first year of a newer boat! I figure if you have to worry about payments, maintenance and gas cost, maybe you should take up golf? :-)
 
By pig I think he means the same thing I mean by stating it, as we moved up from a 2000 Maxum 2400 SCR with a single 5.0 to a 330 with twin 454's. Gas consumption went from 7-9 mpg to 25+ mpgs. We were not prepared for this and never really even thought about it pre-purchase.
 
Comparing gas consumption? A single engine 2465 with a 330? How is that even a comparison? Much like comparing a 40 foot diesel pusher RV with a truck camper!! When you say "pig" what does that mean? What is the difference in mpg? There are too many variables and nothing concrete in the statement other than "pig"! If it's that bad, sell it and return to the 2465! Sorry, I'm off my soapbox.

What Greg said. My Regal burned between 5 and 7 GPH and ran comfortably at 25 knots doing so at between 2+ and 3 MPG. The 330 burns over 20 GPH and depending on sea state, runs around 21 knots (I'm still dialing the sweet spot in). I haven't figured the mileage out yet. Probably just over 1 MPG.

Go back to the 2465? Nope. As I said..."For my needs, a combination of the two would be the perfect boat."
 
OK, there is something wierd in my profile I guess I need to change it. We currently own a 1982 SRV 260SXL 26' with 8' beam, single OMC 260 IO we've had her for 8 years but are out growing her. We= me, wife, two kids, 15 and 11. We are not that concerned with speed, more with accomodations for sleeping the family and maybe a kids friend(s) from time to time. We like to fish so boats with all that molded in upholstery seating in the cockpit are not good. We use our boat as a floating condo as well as fishing platform, entertainment platform, and general second home. We don't spend nights on the hook only at the marina and hopefully with a larger boat we will cruise to some nearby marinas and do the weekend transient thing. Speed is not a major factor but I don't want a displacement hull either. We like the layout and lines of the late '80s Sundancers particularly the 300 and 340. The 340 I think will be too large for our slip(slips where we boat take years to get so finding another one to fit the boat is not a viable option). Also, with the price of fuel going out of sight, I'm not sure a 340 with twin 7.4s and vee drives is a good idea either. I'd love to look at new boats but the finances will not poermit that. I am very mechanically capable and still agile at 45. I have been in some impossible positions on our current boat so I doubt it will be much tighter in a larger boat. That said, I'm not looking for a project boat either, I'd like a trun key baot that someone has taken care of and kept updated. From what I've seen on the net, there are quite a few 300s out there in good to better than average shape, so I think its a matter of finding a nice one and getting it surveyed.
I asked about any known trouble spots so that I can pay special attention to those areas prior to even talking to a surveyor. ie I know that Sea Ray had issues with water in the flotation foam on some of their '80s boats as well as failing to properly seal limber holes and other exposed wood, leading to rot and headaches. I'm looking for first hand knowledge of any special areas of concern to watch out for.
Thanks for the replies and keep them coming.
 
JTS, you mentioned a trailer, what kiind do you have and what do you use as a tow vehicle? How do you like trailereing the boat, is it stable? I ask since I have a large building I store my current boat in during the winter. Its nice to go out in Jan turn on the heat and get some work done even if its snowing. I'd be interested in towing twice per year once in the spring and back in the fall, or if a hurricane is coming. Also, what do permits cost up in the NW? I've got an '08 F250 4x4 6.4L Powerstroke Crewcab long wheelbase rated to tow 12,500 with a standard receiver hitch. BTW, about what does a trailer like yours set you back?
 
That narrows things considerably. I am more partial to the Sea Ray Express Cruiser than the Sundancer for weight distribution and fishability. However, until you get to the 40' range, the Sundancer offers far more interior space. Overnighting with 2 teens.....The Nimitz would seem small!!!!

Trailer requires outdrives or surface piercing drives.

They are out there. You'll find it

Don't rule out Maxum or Bayliner. Both great choices as well. Not all the glitz of a Sea Ray but a lot of boat for the money.

SORRY........but no links to other forum's.
 
I just glanced at the posts, sorry kids are busy wrapping presents and it's a little wild around here this evening...

One boat I would consider, perhaps is the 97 270 Dancer, still a trailerable beam...(I think 98 went a little wider, and lost the pulpit)

We had one with a 7.4 Bravo III, and to this day still is one of my favorite boats we've owned, had a pretty roomy aft cabin/cave, that was not too bad, convertible vee, plenty of power, massive torque, and not bad on fuel, and the space was pretty impressive as I recall, cockpit was exceptional for a 27 and engine room, with a single, was outstanding..

We pulled it all over the midwest behind a 1500 Dodge ram, on an aluminum tri axle trailer w/brakes, never a problem, except for the 12mpg of the truck...

Had a fold up aft seat in the cockpit to create more room, full camper canvas, vacuflush, nice seating, sight lines from helm were impressive, double helm seat, bow pulpit, good headroom in the cabin (though we're on the short side) and excellent cockpit room...

Looks like they are running in the 20-30k range right now, and the big block really did a nice job, the lowest bow rise of any boat we've owned, tracked and turned on a dime without any cavatition whatsoever.

Cannot recall performance stats, but I know she topped 40mph/GPS, fuel consumption was not bad at cruise either, but do not recall exactly.

Perhaps this could be an option? This is one boat, in this size, I would recommend to just about anyone, and perhaps one of the cheapest to own, maintain and easiest to handle of all the boats this "sickness" has brought us : )
 
Our trailer is homemade! Yes, people can still weld in this day and age. It was a copy cat based on an EZ Loader design, but with some heavier metal and beams to support the boat. It also has electric brakes which are extremely nice when backing down the ramp. You can stop instead of sliding until the boat hits the water! I think a new trailer would be around $7,000 or so. Being larger, it doesn't tow any different. It's very stable. There is an art to missing signs and posts that are on the street side of a sidewalk or in the middle of a median. After a while, you get used to the 11 foot beam. Launching is just as easy and before and loading is easier than loading our 250 DA. I have to pay attention to where the water line is when it floats off. When I back the trailer into retrieve, I put that waterline at the same spot on the truck so that I only have to winch the boat a foot or so. With the 250 I was winching 4 - 6 feet and my right arm was huge at the end of the season!

We tow it with a little isuzu diesel. You know, the dually version sold by Chevy!! It's a Duramax Crew Cab long bed rated to tow 16,500 lbs. We have a distribution hitch and it's about 14,000 lbs back there. I tried to stay as close to the 80% of the vehicle max for longevity. It's a little over, but still well within the rating loaded up and with the family in the truck.

An annual overwide permit costs $90 in Washington State and it's honored by the seven Western states, so I don't have to stop in each one while driving through. We spend most of our time in Northern Idaho but often head to Flathead lake in Montana and will hit the San Juans as well. I can't tow on the book ends of the three holiday weekends or through various routes during rush hour. Those routes are all in the Seattle area, so I don't worry about them unless I'm going to Anacortes.

It's a great boat for the four of us and the dogs (a Golden Retriever and a lop-sided *******(Lhasa Apso)). We use it in a similar fashion that you described. We've never been in a marina and always trailer it. We can sleep one on the dinette and two in the V-berth or mid-cabin and one or two can sleep out under the stars if the kids want to bring a buddy. We love the layout, the size and the ease of use. Its much easier getting to the forward deck with the arch and larger walkway. The 250 that we have is a little tight and unnerving going forward if the water is rough. With the 300 DA there is much more room and something to hold onto while headed forward. It's also nice to have the hot water, enough battery power to run the refrigerator overnight and space for everyone and their stuff.

I saw one option that I wish we had. Our aft seat folds down from the transom, but there was an option where it could fold out into a bed! I'm looking at that to see if I can build a similar seat/bed!
 
We have a 1990 280 da with the 4.3lx's and the alpha drives. This was our first year with the boat and put about 100 hours on it and we also really like the layout.
I do fish and the fold up transom seat with the 10.5' beam makes this a pretty good candidate for fishing.
The cockpit is smaller then weekenders and the raised helm is something I didn't think I would like, but I learned that it is easier to see and like the wide helm seat.
We are in the great lakes and have no issues with the stern drives...3600 rpm cruise at about 26 mph...gph seems good for the set up. The cabin is very comfortable and plenty of room for this size boat.
As mentioned cabin and window leaks are what to look for. We had to reseal a hatch and the stations for the bow rail.
The stringers and transom can have excess mositure on this age boat...we got a dry one.
Good luck on your search.
 
I do wish we had the "European" option on the transom seat. It was offered overseas and had a second piece that could be added to the existing seat to turn it into a bed or "Aft Lounge" as they call it. I'm thinking about building that other piece! It might come in real handy when the kids bring friends. I think it just had a second set of piano hinges that allowed it to swing out if you needed it.
 
We've had our '89 300 Sundancer for three seasons now. Absolutely love the boat. It was cherry with 300 hours and always stored heated in the winter. We purchased it from the original owner. We use it as a weekend cottage and find it to have ample room for our needs. Salmon fishing (downrigger type trolling) is our primary activity but we manage one extended trip each season. Cruising uses 16 to 18 gph at about 2800 rpm getting about 26 mph. Top speed is up around the 40 mph mark. I'm running 14.5" dia x 17" pitch aluminum props. I bought it with 14 x 19 props and that was a bit over propped.
 
Thanks Play, thats the kind of info I need. That cruise gph sounds good as does the top end, wow!
 
The one issue that is a bit of an irritation is the angle that the boat sits at rest. It's kind of like living on a hill. With the stern drives tucked all the way to the transom, the boat does sit a bit tail heavy. Having all my trolling equipment at the back doesn't help any, but that's not the real cause. The sink in the galley will always retain a little water due to the drain location not being at the lowest point of the sink. I have to shim the electric skillet when I fry an egg so they don't all end up in a heap. But those are minor annoyances compared to the overall livability and performance that I get out of the boat. I posted a picture on page 11 of the thread "show your boat" in ask the captain section if you're interested.
 
Nice looking boat Play! I've noticed other 300SDs tend to squat at rest. I think most all Searay sterndrives sit a bit stern low at rest. How does she ride at cruise, a bit bow high?
Where is the water tank located? On my 260 its under the vee berth and I use it as a built in ballast tank, fill it at the start of the weekend and it trims the boat out fairly level.
 
I thought I was looking at MY boat! Nice pics Play! I just the love those lines and the color too! We may have to invest in some new canvas, or have it re-sewn. We've got the slant back now, but I'd go with a camper back like your boat has. Our 250 has that and it makes it so much more convenient when it's up.

136-3608_IMG1.jpg


I just have to straighten up the antenna next spring. What a great boat!!

That marina looks familiar based on some pictures from a sailboat guy I know in Mt. Pleasant that moores his sailboat in a very similar setting. I think he has a 28 foot Columbia or some such boat.
 
She rides fairly level at cruise. Even at idle speed running out the channel, it levels out some compared to at rest. I have been is some boats where the bow pulpit "spooned" up a little water in a moderate chop. This boat has never threatened that condition and I've been caught in some nasty stuff a couple times. I do use the trim tabs to get the boat on plane. It will do it without the tabs, but takes soooo much longer and soooo much more throttle. The fresh water tank is under the cockpit floor on the port side equal to the helm bench. The waste tank is immediately aft of that. We had the canvas made by a local guy two years ago. We used Seamark (coated Sunbrella) for the tops. Fantastic stuff and totally waterproof. Side curtains and other pieces are standard Sunbrella. We also had a drop curtain made that drops straight down from the front top and snaps along the back of the helm over the aft cabin window. It has a full width screen/isenglass window behind the helm bench. This lets us stay warm and/or dry and/or bug free while trolling yet still gives full use of the open cockpit for fishing.
 
I'm amazed at how quickly and easily our 300 gets on plane. Our 250 struggles when you give her the juice but the 454 gets it done. On the 300, you just set the throttles at 3,000 rpm and it comes up on plane. You can give her more throttle and it will come up faster and smoother with a lot less bow lift than our 250 too. It requires less fiddling with the trim tabs which makes it seem much more stable. It corners better, more like an airplane or our old 19 footer. The 250 corners OK, but there is a lot of sliding unless you've got it trimmed just right. It's just a great all around boat. I can't wait until April! :-(
 
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