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- May 14, 2001
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- 4570
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- 1,381
"Why would I anchor in an inlet? By the way, I have 2 anchors."
Bob, what would you do if youe engine quit while entering an inlet??? Perhaps an anchor would keep you off the rocks and the bow pointed into the seas (of course in a bowrider it may not make much difference) until someone comes to get you! It is questions like that, that make some of us wonder.
Bob, what would you do if youe engine quit while entering an inlet??? Perhaps an anchor would keep you off the rocks and the bow pointed into the seas (of course in a bowrider it may not make much difference) until someone comes to get you! It is questions like that, that make some of us wonder.
Walter, I asked the question because our bud Bob said that he never heard of a current table. Mike and Pascal touched on the subject but everyone running inlets needs to understand that tides and currents are not synonymous. Professional mariners are less concerned about high and low tide than they are about slack current. Let's look at Lake Worth Inlet, for example - it's a nice, wide inlet with plenty of depth. Low tide today is at 6:07 in the port. However, slack current does not occur for almost two hours - at 7:58. In fact, at 6 AM, the current is ebbing at 3.5 knots. If there is a decent onshore breeze, you'll find steep, potentially breaking waves in the inlet at dead low tide. Sea Tow and BoatUS love inlets because they get to salvage overturned boats in them on a regular basis.
Running inlets safely, as most here know, requires greater skill and knowledge than lake or bay boating does. Most "accidents" occur when someone heads out an inlet, gets in the middle of the mess and then decides to turn around. That move, in itself, requires skill because you need to complete the turn in between waves, basically a powered turn that must be completed before the next wave catches your beam. With an ebbing current, you are better off transversing the inlet, getting into calmer seas and then making your turn. First choice, of course, is not entering it at all if conditions are not good. While judging wave height in an inlet can be difficult, if you see two foot swells rolling in before you even get to the inlet, you can assume conditions are much worse in the inlet itself.
But the important lesson here is that ducks and geese are not the same, bears and moose are not the same, coke and pepsi are not the same and tides and currents are not the same.
Running inlets safely, as most here know, requires greater skill and knowledge than lake or bay boating does. Most "accidents" occur when someone heads out an inlet, gets in the middle of the mess and then decides to turn around. That move, in itself, requires skill because you need to complete the turn in between waves, basically a powered turn that must be completed before the next wave catches your beam. With an ebbing current, you are better off transversing the inlet, getting into calmer seas and then making your turn. First choice, of course, is not entering it at all if conditions are not good. While judging wave height in an inlet can be difficult, if you see two foot swells rolling in before you even get to the inlet, you can assume conditions are much worse in the inlet itself.
But the important lesson here is that ducks and geese are not the same, bears and moose are not the same, coke and pepsi are not the same and tides and currents are not the same.
I think you need to focus on the words. The question was whether it was "reckless." To me that implies an unreasonable danger to life (yours and others). The fact that he was risking his own boat is not decisive in my opinion; and I think the precautions he took probably kept life and limb relatively under control.
Was it....
... safe? (No.)
... prudent? (No.)
... risky? (Yes.)
... bold? (Yes.)
... a calculated risk? (Yes.)
... reckless? (No.)
Was it....
... safe? (No.)
... prudent? (No.)
... risky? (Yes.)
... bold? (Yes.)
... a calculated risk? (Yes.)
... reckless? (No.)
B
blouderback
Guest
Anchor as a safety item, OK, now I understand. You see, I'm not the kind of guy that plays out every scenerio in my mind before it happens (who can?), but I can react quickly and with a lot of common sense. For example, before running the inlet, I gave no thought to making sure I didn't "broach", but when I got in the inlet and saw that broaching (a new term I just learned here) could possibly happen, I adjusted and worked the throttle and wheel so that I wouldn't let that happen. Same thing with the anchor - I never thought to myself, "gee, if my engine quits, I'll just set the anchor and keep myself off the rocks", but I'm pretty sure that if that happened, I would see myself heading for trouble and react properly with the anchors.
What was your plan for learning the not so intuative reasons on why you are broaching and the fact that as you turn your steering wheel it does not seem to have any effect on where your boat is going?
Then go back and take your own poll again and be honest.
How do you "plan" to be safe in knowing the 101 list of things you need to know about running an inlet and not even discover the term broaching?
bp
..maintaining that a 20 foot bowrider could be safe given the conditions, but that the information needed to do so was insufficient.
Then go back and take your own poll again and be honest.
How do you "plan" to be safe in knowing the 101 list of things you need to know about running an inlet and not even discover the term broaching?
bp
..maintaining that a 20 foot bowrider could be safe given the conditions, but that the information needed to do so was insufficient.
- Joined
- May 14, 2001
- RO Number
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Bob, Someone with "many years experience" and "hundreds of hours at the helm" (these are your words), should at least be thinking of things that could go wrong while traversing an inlet, such as loss of power or steering. It is not prudent to wait until one of these things happen and then try and figure out what to do. Another quetion for you, have you ever thought about what you would do in the event of a man overboard?? What would you wife, or crew do in the event you went overboard?? On my boat we occasionally practice a "man overboard drill", where we throw a PFD in the water and practice what we would do if someone fell overboard. Just for kicks sometime, throw a PFD in the water and step away from the helm (at idle speed and insuring there is no other traffic) and tell youf wife or crew "I jsut fell overboard". The reaction may tell you some things you need to concentrate on. Boating is great fun, but also has an element of danger involved.
B
blouderback
Guest
Is it important to know the term "broaching", or is it important to realize that it's not a good thing to have the boat sort of slow down when coming down a wave and turn sideways to the wave? As soon as I felt that start to happen, I realized the best thing to do was to not let the boat "stall" going down the wave, but rather put more power into it so that I kept the boat moving in a forward direction. Voila, no more of that possible "broching" thingy.
That's the difference with me, I am very intuative, but don't often know the "official" term for things (hence frequent my use of the word "thingy").
That's the difference with me, I am very intuative, but don't often know the "official" term for things (hence frequent my use of the word "thingy").
B
blouderback
Guest
Pete, good idea! We've nver done that kind of thing, but I often "think out-loud" as I'm doing things, for the benefit of the crew and guests. For example, I'll say things like, "Gotta turn that blower on", or "You know where those PFD are stowed, right?", or "Listen to that guy on channel 16, requestiing assistance.", or "look at the gps, here's where it shows our longitude/latitude.".
I guess I just don't make a list of things that could go wrong with the appropriate reaction, but in the back of my mind, I think I have a pretty good idea what to do given the situation.
I guess I just don't make a list of things that could go wrong with the appropriate reaction, but in the back of my mind, I think I have a pretty good idea what to do given the situation.
quote:
Originally posted by blouderback
Is it important to know the term "broaching", or is it important to realize that it's not a good thing to have the boat sort of slow down when coming down a wave and turn sideways to the wave? As soon as I felt that start to happen, I realized the best thing to do was to not let the boat "stall" going down the wave, but rather put more power into it so that I kept the boat moving in a forward direction. Voila, no more of that possible "broching" thingy.
That's the difference with me, I am very intuative, but don't often know the "official" term for things (hence frequent my use of the word "thingy").
Of course too much power and then you wind up pitch poling as you bury the bow.
But I'm sure you knew that.
Actually it is important to know that term. Not knowing it means you haven't really taken the time to study boat handling by reading such things a Chapmans ($65) or taking a course ($small fee).
You seem to prefer to come here, ask questions ($free), then argue with people that try to educate you ($priceless), because you are taught to doubt the wisdom of those with more experience then you.
A lot of people have short memories and look at each of your threads as a stand alone entry. Some can see the total picture you present which really paints you in a foolish light. You and others may not agree with that but thats the way I see it.
- Joined
- Mar 9, 2005
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quote:
Originally posted by rommer
quote:
Originally posted by blouderback
Is it important to know the term "broaching", or is it important to realize that it's not a good thing to have the boat sort of slow down when coming down a wave and turn sideways to the wave? As soon as I felt that start to happen, I realized the best thing to do was to not let the boat "stall" going down the wave, but rather put more power into it so that I kept the boat moving in a forward direction. Voila, no more of that possible "broching" thingy.
That's the difference with me, I am very intuative, but don't often know the "official" term for things (hence frequent my use of the word "thingy").
Of course too much power and then you wind up pitch poling as you bury the bow.
But I'm sure you knew that.
Yes...I was just going to say "go ahead - damn the torpedoes and full speed ahead - give me warp speed Mr. Scott"...and the forward half of your boat will be underwater in a New York second.
You have to learn to play the throttle and stay on the back of the wave. Too fast, you go over onto the face...too slow, the wave behind you gets you. It's all feel and experience.
You knew that coming over the top of the wave was not good though and that's a start.
I"m wondering if Bob had included in the Original Posting about Venturing out into the ocean that he also had his wife and apparently another couple with him if some of the responses would have been different?
Where on the boat were those other three people sitting Bob?
Where on the boat were those other three people sitting Bob?
Bob, you are scaring me. Stall going down a wave? Is that something that bowriders do? Power down a wave? Try that and you'll stuff that bow of yours so far down you'll need a periscope to check traffic. You need to remember that the wave doesn't move - regardless of how it seems. The water goes up and down. Your prop has the same effect as it would in flat water.
- Joined
- Apr 12, 2006
- RO Number
- 20824
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- 2,958
quote:
Originally posted by rommer
quote:
Originally posted by blouderback
Is it important to know the term "broaching", or is it important to realize that it's not a good thing to have the boat sort of slow down when coming down a wave and turn sideways to the wave? As soon as I felt that start to happen, I realized the best thing to do was to not let the boat "stall" going down the wave, but rather put more power into it so that I kept the boat moving in a forward direction. Voila, no more of that possible "broching" thingy.
That's the difference with me, I am very intuative, but don't often know the "official" term for things (hence frequent my use of the word "thingy").
Of course too much power and then you wind up pitch poling as you bury the bow.
But I'm sure you knew that.
Rommer:
WTF - you just spoiled next weeks thread from Bob.