BREAKING NEWS

quote:
Originally posted by Philyteach

Conspiracy theories are sexy, but I bet we find that its something far more boring like loss of situational awareness. One boat broke down for whatever reason and everyone was too busy with "something else" to watch the gps and the approaching Iranians. Once they knew what was happening, they would be wrong to use deadly force inside another country's territorial waters. Its a literal act of war.

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The Navy trains daily in the art of towing. One boat could easily tow the second.

Unless all four engines conked out at the same time and drifted for miles into "Iranian Territory." Of course these trained seaman sat around smoking while this went on. No calls, nothing. They also lost their anchors. Then they saw a couple of bad boys and panicked and threw up their hands in surrender. They said to said SN's here take our boats and weapons and arrest us.

Then got on their knees and posed for a phot- op and a confession of malfeasance, took off their shoes and waited for chow.

That fantasy sounds more like a John "the war hero" Kerry event than reality.

But if you buy this GUMINT BS I got a bridge in Brooklyn that I can sell you real cheap.
 
quote:
Originally posted by Joeshoes

quote:
Originally posted by KiDa

quote:
Originally posted by Phillbo

I'm sure there was more to it given the fact the boats were transporting Seals.

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Much deeper than that.

Both boats break in the same place at the same time? Both boats lose contact with the fleet at the same time? They "drifted" into national waters. Both boats had anchors. The crew is highly specialized and unless there was some really bad fuel the odds on 4 Yanmars going Tango Oscar simultaneously is slim.

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BING BING BING Correct answer!!

With all the electronic and other gear on these two boats they "drifted" into enemy waters?

Why did they not fight for their ship? Orders directly from the top to surrender??

Bull****

A coverup worthy of Benghazi fame.

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LOL.

Tin foil hat sales must be up along with guns. Or is it a BOGO kinda deal these days?
 
quote:
Originally posted by Philyteach

Conspiracy theories are sexy, but I bet we find that its something far more boring like loss of situational awareness. One boat broke down for whatever reason and everyone was too busy with "something else" to watch the gps and the approaching Iranians. Once they knew what was happening, they would be wrong to use deadly force inside another country's territorial waters. Its a literal act of war.

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You know me Phillyteach, I say conspiracy theories are for the weak of mind. However in this case, the story being told to the public is simply not creditable. We don't deserve the truth in all matters of national security, but neither do we need to be BS'd. If we are to send our sons and daughters in harms way, we need to know their courage is being used for a valiant purpose.
 
Who knows why the 2 teams really ended up there, but the news of the other essentially simultaneous prisoner swap and concessions deal which had been in the works for quite a while would seem to add more acceptable rationale for the quick release of these American military personnel.
 
Look I will buy any explanation of how they got there, but the use of pictures of detainees for purposes of propaganda is a violation of international standards and if this was some sort of test of Iran's sincerity, the handing to them of a propaganda opportunity makes it even worse.
 
Here's an email I just got...

"I rarely pull out my dusty old trident, but in this case, here goes. I was a Navy SEAL officer in the 1980s, and this kind of operation (transiting small boats in foreign waters) was our bread and butter. Today, these boats both not only had radar, but multiple GPS devices, including chart plotters that place your boat's icon right on the chart. The claim by Iran that the USN boats "strayed into Iranian waters" is complete bull****!
For an open-water transit between nations, the course is studied and planned in advance by the leaders of the Riverine Squadron, with specific attention given to staying wide and clear of any hostile nation's claimed territorial waters. The boats are given a complete mechanical check before departure, and they have sufficient fuel to accomplish their mission plus extra. If, for some unexplainable and rare circumstance one boat broke down, the other would tow it, that's why two boats go on these trips and not one! It's called "self-rescue" and it's SOP.
This entire situation is in my area of expertise. I can state with complete confidence that both Iran and our own State Department are lying. The boats did not enter Iranian waters. They were overtaken in international waters by Iranian patrol boats that were so superior in both speed and firepower that it became a "hands up!" situation, with automatic cannons in the 40mm to 76mm range pointed at them point-blank. Surrender, hands up, or be blown out of the water. I assume that the Iranians had an English speaker on a loudspeaker to make the demand. This takedown was no accident or coincidence, it was a planned slap across America's face.
Just watch. The released sailors will be ordered not to say a word about the incident, and the Iranians will have taken every GPS device, chart-plotter etc off the boats, so that we will not be able to prove where our boats were taken.
The "strayed into Iranian waters" story being put out by Iran and our groveling and appeasing State Dept. is utter and complete BS from one end to the other." - Matt Bracken
 
Have to agree that we've been told at best half the real story, more likely 20%. From my experience in Afghanistan, only about half (at best) of ground truth reaches stateside via the press, and that is on a good day. Throw in a politically sensitive/charged situation like this, and you'd be lucky to really know 25%.

V/R
 
http://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-iran-boats-idUSKCN0Y3313 "The U.S. Navy said on Thursday that it had fired the commander of the 10 American sailors who wandered into Iranian territorial waters in the Gulf in January..."

<snip>

"The Navy has not yet released the results of its investigation,..."
 
They fired the wrong Commander.
Both vessels had twin Diesels and the initial story about a breakdown is unbelievable. I wonder if the crew even had ammo. to prevent capture given the rules of engagement from Washington.
Looks like the firing of the commander is a scapegoat move since it is inconsistent with earlier stories
 
The stories that I read said they fired the Executive Officer (XO). He is not a commander.

The stories also said the investigation continues. I cannot understand just why it is taking so long.

"WASHINGTON (AP) — The Navy has fired the commander of the 10 American sailors who wandered into Iranian territorial waters in the Persian Gulf and were captured and held by Iran for about 15 hours.

In a statement Thursday, the Navy said it had lost confidence in Cmdr. Eric Rasch, who was the executive officer of the squadron that included the 10 sailors at the time of the January incident. He was responsible for the training and readiness of the more than 400 sailors in the unit."

Another story by reporters who do not know what they are writing about.

George
 
quote:
Originally posted by Kevdon22

Looks like the firing of the commander is a scapegoat move since it is inconsistent with earlier stories

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In the military its not a scapegoat, its called Responsibility.
 
^^Not from what I've seen in the last several years.
 
Firing of the XO instead of the Commander may be a scapegoat.

George
 
Unless things have gone absolutely bassackwards, I thought the only person who could fire the XO was the CO.
 
quote:
Originally posted by KiDa

Unless things have gone absolutely bassackwards, I thought the only person who could fire the XO was the CO.

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Anybody the XO in the chain of command can fire the XO.

What is strange is firing the XO and not the CO.

George
 
The XO assumed command of the unit after the incident happened. He surely knew he was going to be the Commander for a short time.
 
quote:
Originally posted by Gregory S

The XO assumed command of the unit after the incident happened. He surely knew he was going to be the Commander for a short time.

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I'm confused..... He assumes command after the fact and is relieved after that.

Where did the relief for cause orders come from?

As stated earlier. It doesn't add up based on previous published information.
 
As XO he was responsible for training that was clearly lacking.

Original CO saw the writing on the wall and immediately put in his retirement papers, xo takes over pending final investigation (to show that he was not " prematurely" judged). Investigation plays out old XO now CO pays the price for poor training and ops readyness while he was XO.
 
Still not buying it the whole story. The navy has been crucifying too many for bizarre reasons for the last 4-5 years.

Unless you are part of a reduction in force, you carry what are affectionately known as "hip pocket orders". You are available for recall for any purpose up to the age of 55. It was a way around "retirement" pay at a young age. From "retirement" til age 55 one receives retainer pay. At 55 you go on the retired rolls. It has to do with the color of money that pays you. O8 and above never go on the retired rolls.
 
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